Feedback Needed My first Episode
- Thread starter lonerockz
- Start date
Hippo-Drones
Pleb
added it to my watch later list for tonights night shift.
Hippo-Drones
Pleb
Awesome video mate, nice flow and (I hate music in videos but felt yours added to the video) really good use of music to set the tone and feel of the clips etc. You also kept us engaged with alternate angles.
You asked for ways you might improve though...
The 360 camera needs to face you directly, the angle you have it at is causing some distortion when the shot is back at you and also looks terrible when facing front (IMO)
Also regarding the 360 footage, this is something I am guilty of too... is trying to capture too much in the frame, which massively distorts the image. I'd suggest, if panning to a view, to try and keep the window close to being completely undistorted, so you will not see the road in front and yourself and road behind in the side shots, it will also remove the distorted view of the bike too. The only way to fit more in shot with a 360 camera and avoid distortion, is to move it further away, so on a selfie-stick, which on tarmac can be an issue.
It is great to switch camera angles, but try to do it so they add... not much point as an example to have it face yourself if you are not saying anything or showing anything, so (again IMO) it might be better to cut parts out completely if they don't add to the video.
We all have our own editing styles, and ideas for how we want our videos to feel, so please take my above words with a pinch of salt, they are just observations from my limited experience and opinion.
Thank you for asking our thoughts, to me, that is the stuff this forum is for, where we can have discussions without offending, and it is also just between the members on here, rather than in a comment on the actual video.
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
Thanks for taking the time to give me thoughtful feedback!
It is kind of a stylistic choice to have the distortion. Its not distracting to me, but I may not be in the majority, and I want to make something watchable by most! I'll have to experiment more with that. At the 13:42 mark I roll past some great street art, how did that look to you?
One thing I learned on this day is that my 360 camera front lens gets super dirty, and I didn't clean it. So any footage that uses that is terrible. Luckily I learned this and on days 2 & 3 the footage is much better. I also think I have some settings wrong in Davinci that is making it worse. I need to dive back in. (I'm working on days 2 and 3 right now and discovered this.)
Glad you liked the music! It makes my Motion Array subscription seem worth it. I don't have enough talking to cover the whole video and I wanted to set a "mood" that makes you feel like you are on the trip with me.
TallADVer
Compulsive Hobbyist
Hey, Lonerocz!
Even though I'm a noob when it comes to motovlogging, I'm a long-time moto video watcher, which gives me just enough expertise to say: amazing job for a first time production! Seriously, that was a very well put together video. I appreciate moderately long videos with intelligent and interesting content, which I think makes me pretty much your target audience. I felt that you found a good balance between riding footage, destination shots, and historical information from your voiceovers.
You made really nice use of your drone footage, for example the panning shots over the castle. I've been debating whether my next camera purchase should be a 360 or a drone, and while I think I'll get more use out of the 360 for day to day videos, after seeing this, a drone is definitely going to be on my next "big trip" packing list.
Regarding the 360, I agree with Hippo's take on some of the ultra-wide shots. I totally got that they were done for stylistic reasons, but I felt like they pulled me out of the video rather than drawing me into it. I would have preferred a couple of narrower shots from different angles, or even a long panning shot (which would have worked nicely on the suspension bridge, imo). But you also used the 360 to very cool effect when you were riding down the narrow streets past those murals!
I liked your use of still photos when describing locations, and the blanking fill effect for the portrait shots was effective. While I do like the use of dynamic zoom for most of the photos, in a couple of cases the zoom effect was a bit too fast (for example, around 3:26 when you zoom in to the castle entryway). Maybe I just noticed it because I've also struggled with achieving the smooth dynamic zoom effects in Resolve. Occasionally, using "ease in" and "ease out" can help in some situations, but other times I just need to reduce the zoom amount.
And I liked your music choices, which set a fun tone, and aided the "flow" of the video. Nice job getting the levels right, I never felt that the music got in the way of either the dialogue or the background sounds.
Really nice job - I'll definitely tune in for the rest!
Chris
Even though I'm a noob when it comes to motovlogging, I'm a long-time moto video watcher, which gives me just enough expertise to say: amazing job for a first time production! Seriously, that was a very well put together video. I appreciate moderately long videos with intelligent and interesting content, which I think makes me pretty much your target audience. I felt that you found a good balance between riding footage, destination shots, and historical information from your voiceovers.
You made really nice use of your drone footage, for example the panning shots over the castle. I've been debating whether my next camera purchase should be a 360 or a drone, and while I think I'll get more use out of the 360 for day to day videos, after seeing this, a drone is definitely going to be on my next "big trip" packing list.
Regarding the 360, I agree with Hippo's take on some of the ultra-wide shots. I totally got that they were done for stylistic reasons, but I felt like they pulled me out of the video rather than drawing me into it. I would have preferred a couple of narrower shots from different angles, or even a long panning shot (which would have worked nicely on the suspension bridge, imo). But you also used the 360 to very cool effect when you were riding down the narrow streets past those murals!
I liked your use of still photos when describing locations, and the blanking fill effect for the portrait shots was effective. While I do like the use of dynamic zoom for most of the photos, in a couple of cases the zoom effect was a bit too fast (for example, around 3:26 when you zoom in to the castle entryway). Maybe I just noticed it because I've also struggled with achieving the smooth dynamic zoom effects in Resolve. Occasionally, using "ease in" and "ease out" can help in some situations, but other times I just need to reduce the zoom amount.
And I liked your music choices, which set a fun tone, and aided the "flow" of the video. Nice job getting the levels right, I never felt that the music got in the way of either the dialogue or the background sounds.
Really nice job - I'll definitely tune in for the rest!
Chris
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
Chris, thanks so much for the kind words!
I’ll definitely revisit the 360 framing. One of my learnings is to take less photos and do more video, even for static things like paintings and such. I don’t spend much time on the pan/zoom on the photos, and sadly it does show.
I’m still learning Davinci and working on my workflow. Right now it’s not sustainable. Probably have 20 hours into that video. Not including script writing and voice recording. Need to get it down. Hoping with practice and effort it could get down to 5 hours or so. I have too many cameras. Each camera adds so much more time to edit.
The drone is great, but not in the USA. So much red tape and busybodies that don’t like them. In Portugal I just play dumb.
Thanks again!
TallADVer
Compulsive Hobbyist
I really believe that there's value in bringing in still photos, at least for certain styles. I probably won't do it much with a pure vlog, but when there's more of a narrative style (as in your case), I think it can give it a professional polish. It's just tricky to get the timing right. But I think you did many of your photo pan & zooms quite well.
I'm far from a Resolve expert, having taught myself recently through a mix of trial & error and a few Youtube tutorials (though I've just finally gotten round to downloading the training books, which I think will help). As for workflow, I think that just comes with time. I've been working on several different styles of videos: in-studio single camera + B roll (hobby-related stuff), screen capture (tutorial stuff), no-dialogue process videos (for my wife's antique furniture restoration side hustle), sports photo montage, and now motovlogs. Each style seems to require its own somewhat different workflow, at least when assembling the rough cut. For me, figuring out pacing and length is generally the hardest part, and it's very iterative. Meaning, I can't get close to a good edit in a single pass, it really requires multiple sessions in order to distill the video down to its best (aka shortest) form. I already see that this gets quicker and easier over time, both because I'm spending less time struggling with the tools, and also because I'm kind of intuitively understanding the structure and pacing for each style a little better with each attempt.
And, as you said, multiple cameras brings its own challenges. Either you get a big bucket of clips that you need to sequence into a linear timeline in the rough cut (which is what I've been doing so far for my other videos), or you sync everything together up front, so you can use the actual multicam controls to switch between them on the fly. I assumed you were doing the latter with your video? That's what I'm planning to do once I get a 360 cam, since it's a real bear in Resolve to constantly shuffle the length and position of clips. But then, the 360 stuff adds yet another layer as you then need to factor in adjusting the view for each clip, right? It's enough to make my head spin just thinking about it.
Anyway, that's a long-winded way of saying that 20 hours' editing for a video like that, especially if this stuff is all new to you, sounds about right, no matter what editing tools you use.
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
Thanks for the vote of confidence!
Yes I do use the Multicam feature of DaVinci with the on bike footage. @Drakhen99 has a great tutorial on his channel. I have realized that I pause quite a bit while talking on the bike. So I trim out the pauses with a camera switch to hide the cut. I was using the "supported" KartaVR 360 plugin, but the camera feature on the plugin used in Drakhen's video is really useful so I've switched to that.
Currently I'm doing like 5+ passes on each segment to get it good. I'm hoping to get it to 2 or 3. Time will tell!
Yes I do use the Multicam feature of DaVinci with the on bike footage. @Drakhen99 has a great tutorial on his channel. I have realized that I pause quite a bit while talking on the bike. So I trim out the pauses with a camera switch to hide the cut. I was using the "supported" KartaVR 360 plugin, but the camera feature on the plugin used in Drakhen's video is really useful so I've switched to that.
Currently I'm doing like 5+ passes on each segment to get it good. I'm hoping to get it to 2 or 3. Time will tell!
R-Rated
Remember to Have Fun! - Solar Bear 2020 Champion
For me, I listen with headphones so all the audio nuance might not be the same for listening over speakers.
Great audio on your voice when on the bike. Good choice of edits on the camera. The voice over narration was a great choice. It reminded me of Matt Laidlaw. Was the audio processing of the voice over different from the track talking about your goals and Vasco de Gama versus the one about the town Cassiem (spelling)? The two sounded so different that it seemed like a bigger sized man took over the narration for that segment.
The music? It seemed a little too much in many places and not in others. Maybe just a taste of music to set the mood then fade out so the listener does not get competing input when you are talking?
Just my feedback.
Great audio on your voice when on the bike. Good choice of edits on the camera. The voice over narration was a great choice. It reminded me of Matt Laidlaw. Was the audio processing of the voice over different from the track talking about your goals and Vasco de Gama versus the one about the town Cassiem (spelling)? The two sounded so different that it seemed like a bigger sized man took over the narration for that segment.
The music? It seemed a little too much in many places and not in others. Maybe just a taste of music to set the mood then fade out so the listener does not get competing input when you are talking?
Just my feedback.
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
Thanks for the helpful feedback!
I think I was standing up for the Santiago do Cacém audio, vs lying in bed for the other. I was testing different setups for the different sections. I'll be standing up when doing it in the future.
Still working to dial in the right sound levels on the music and what not.
Good point on headphones. I'm doing it on the built in monitor speakers. I should get some good headphones that are neutral sounding. Have any recommendations?
Of course all this will take more time! The one thing that I just can't make more of!
Thanks again,
Steve
R-Rated
Remember to Have Fun! - Solar Bear 2020 Champion
I wish I could recommend a good set of headphones but it seems even the same manufacturer can have a little variation.
The best ones for me listening to audio are Sony WH-CH700N.
All other narration like talking about goals sounded more consistent with your voice on the bike. But I can see the appeal to have it all recorded while standing though just for the difference.
Does your editing software show the sound levels of different frequencies? It would be interesting to compare the two to see what shows as different.
R-Rated
Remember to Have Fun! - Solar Bear 2020 Champion
I hear that. Nothing like one click and POOF back to the age of silent film.
Drakhen99
The Forrest Gump of Motovloggers
Hey, I'm glad that my tutorials were able to help - yay!
I'm typing these notes as I watch your video.
1. Wow, what a first effort - this is great!
2. I get what you were trying to do with the 360 footage, and I also understand other peoples' dislike of the distorted/showing too much. I would recommend going to 0.5-0.6 on the zoom or whatever it's called [I think it's at the bottom, under Tiny Planet] slider in the Reframe360 Inspector. You can reframe for the side shots you were looking to get, without the distortion.
3. On the other hand - I like the distorted view - it's clearly a 360-camera-only viewpoint
4. The v/o work mixed with music and the on-the-bike audio was a great way to tell the story of your journey! Great job!
5. Your production quality is VERY high. Evident from the first minute, it earned my subscription.
6. For audio mixing and leveling, I take ALL of the guesswork out of it by using Alex Audio Butler [and yes, I have a tutorial/review video of it on my channel]. I just drop in whatever music and sound FX I want and let AAB do all the keyframing and stuff for me. Big time-saver.
7. At 08:50, there's a glitch - it looks like a camera angle switch gone awry. Most people won't notice.
8. For transitioning from and to on-bike audio and music, I recommend dragging on the Audio Transition. Use +3dB for transitioning TO, and -3dB for transitioning FROM. This will make the audio flow better, IMO.
9. The pacing is very good, and I never got bored. The mixing in of drone footage was a nice touch, as was the handheld 360 cam at about 10:50.
10. I get that you were testing out different ways of recording the V/O work - once you pick one, they'll all be consistent... so no worries there. I didn't find it distracting.
11. Using Reframe360, you're going to want to render your video in 4k. It will help with the stitch line, which was visible at about the 12:20 mark.
12. Fresnel is pronounced FREN-el or FRAY-nel, FYI I only know this due to me having both Lego sets that include a Lego Fresnel lens element [weird flex, I know].
13. At 13:45, the side-shot from the 360 camera is what I was alluding to in #2 above. You can even "zoom out" a bit using that slider I mentioned before. This will help make things a bit sharper, too.
14. I loved the outro - something I do poorly, you did very well. The video left me wanting more. My suggestion would be to add a statement about watching the next video or something, to give the viewer a clear "next step" - but I get that for your first video, that may be more difficult.
I hope this list helps! Can't wait for more!
-John
I'm typing these notes as I watch your video.
1. Wow, what a first effort - this is great!
2. I get what you were trying to do with the 360 footage, and I also understand other peoples' dislike of the distorted/showing too much. I would recommend going to 0.5-0.6 on the zoom or whatever it's called [I think it's at the bottom, under Tiny Planet] slider in the Reframe360 Inspector. You can reframe for the side shots you were looking to get, without the distortion.
3. On the other hand - I like the distorted view - it's clearly a 360-camera-only viewpoint
4. The v/o work mixed with music and the on-the-bike audio was a great way to tell the story of your journey! Great job!
5. Your production quality is VERY high. Evident from the first minute, it earned my subscription.
6. For audio mixing and leveling, I take ALL of the guesswork out of it by using Alex Audio Butler [and yes, I have a tutorial/review video of it on my channel]. I just drop in whatever music and sound FX I want and let AAB do all the keyframing and stuff for me. Big time-saver.
7. At 08:50, there's a glitch - it looks like a camera angle switch gone awry. Most people won't notice.
8. For transitioning from and to on-bike audio and music, I recommend dragging on the Audio Transition. Use +3dB for transitioning TO, and -3dB for transitioning FROM. This will make the audio flow better, IMO.
9. The pacing is very good, and I never got bored. The mixing in of drone footage was a nice touch, as was the handheld 360 cam at about 10:50.
10. I get that you were testing out different ways of recording the V/O work - once you pick one, they'll all be consistent... so no worries there. I didn't find it distracting.
11. Using Reframe360, you're going to want to render your video in 4k. It will help with the stitch line, which was visible at about the 12:20 mark.
12. Fresnel is pronounced FREN-el or FRAY-nel, FYI
I only know this due to me having both Lego sets that include a Lego Fresnel lens element [weird flex, I know].13. At 13:45, the side-shot from the 360 camera is what I was alluding to in #2 above. You can even "zoom out" a bit using that slider I mentioned before. This will help make things a bit sharper, too.
14. I loved the outro - something I do poorly, you did very well. The video left me wanting more. My suggestion would be to add a statement about watching the next video or something, to give the viewer a clear "next step" - but I get that for your first video, that may be more difficult.
I hope this list helps! Can't wait for more!
-John
Drakhen99
The Forrest Gump of Motovloggers
The Fairlight tab is still a bit of voodoo to me ... I tend to stay away from it except to add Fairlight FX to my tracks, LOL.
There's a lot you can do there, and I recommend the Jay Yadlovski channel on YouTube. He's the Resolve audio guru IMO.
-John
Moto Mengy
Motovlogger from PA, USA
That is a great first video, well done!
My feelings pretty much echo what Hippo and Drakhen said, but especially clean the camera lenses and narrow the 360 cam FoV to reduce the distortion. Other than that you did awesome.
On a less technical but more emotional level of feedback, your vid gave me a bit of an amateur Itchy Boots style impression, and that's a good thing IMHO. I liked it a lot!
My feelings pretty much echo what Hippo and Drakhen said, but especially clean the camera lenses and narrow the 360 cam FoV to reduce the distortion. Other than that you did awesome.
On a less technical but more emotional level of feedback, your vid gave me a bit of an amateur Itchy Boots style impression, and that's a good thing IMHO. I liked it a lot!
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
@Drakhen99, you mentioned Alex Audio Butler in one of your videos. But apparently, they are no longer selling it and are now selling a stand-alone (non-plugin) product called EndBoost on a monthly subscription.
The price seems too high, and exiting my editor and futzing around with another application is a non-starter. Is it that good? Is my mix that bad?
lonerockz
Wannabie Member
@Drakhen99, thanks for taking the time to review the video and provide helpful feedback. One of the things that I've noticed the channels I like do is they have a phrase they repeat in each video. Like ItchyBoots' "Good morning, Internet!" I think mine will be in the outro. I write a script for the voice-over work that needs to include the "Tune in next time for..." kind of teaser.
I'm planning on adding some talking-to-the-camera moments. ItchyBoots always does this, as does "As the Magpie Flies." I think it will improve the connection that viewers will have with me. Of course, I'm a 55-year-old fat guy, not a blonde Dutch girl, so I'll be somewhat disadvantaged!
Off to watch some Davinci Audio tutorials!
MotoWolfUK
L Plate Member
I can’t contribute with feedback as I’m depth as a lot of people here, but just wanted to say - the quality, dual cameras, along with the music - very professional and I’m sure it’ll draw in a lot of viewers who are into the subject.
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