Feedback Needed First Shoutout (of sorts)

[TallADVer]

Hi all,

I know this isn't what is meant by "shoutout" videos, but I wanted to do a very quick video to both start off my motovlogging adventures, as well as to serve as a channel update for my handful of existing subscribers. It also serves as a shoutout to the fine bunch of folks at this little asylum

I'll start the critique myself to get things moving:

• It's too long for the actual content (IMHO). I was aiming at 5-8 min, and ended up at 13. That's partly because it's a dual-purpose video, but it's also just a general struggle with any video I make that involves words coming out of my mouth.
• It's a bit rambling. That's just my general presentation style, but I need to figure out a better way (short of scripting) to make a collection of thoughts seem more like a cohesive narrative.
• Editing could be tighter. For example, the transition between the 3rd person camera to the ride-by to the helmet cam, feels like it's maybe 5 seconds too long.
• Next time I try riding into the frame, I need to mark off exactly where to stop so I'm in focus.

Looking forward to your thoughts!
Chris

 

[Hippo-Drones]

Nice intro Chris, I'd hold off modding the bike a bit for standing until you have spent a bit more time in the dirt. It changes the balance of the bike doing so, although you are pretty tall, so you may find you need to do some tweaks.

As for feedback, I think you covered it off well in you post above, my main feedback would be the volume levels between the on bike and off bike footage, the off bike stuff was spot on, but on bike voice was very loud and distorted at times, think it was clipping a bit. You covered a good topic in the video about jump cuts, I tend to do lots of them in my videos to just go for the parts where I am chatting, keeps the flow going like you mentioned. I don't always bother with bringing multiple cameras, but they really help hide the jump cuts to help smooth the flow.

 

[TallADVer]

Nice intro Chris, I'd hold off modding the bike a bit for standing until you have spent a bit more time in the dirt. It changes the balance of the bike doing so, although you are pretty tall, so you may find you need to do some tweaks.

As for feedback, I think you covered it off well in you post above, my main feedback would be the volume levels between the on bike and off bike footage, the off bike stuff was spot on, but on bike voice was very loud and distorted at times, think it was clipping a bit. You covered a good topic in the video about jump cuts, I tend to do lots of them in my videos to just go for the parts where I am chatting, keeps the flow going like you mentioned. I don't always bother with bringing multiple cameras, but they really help hide the jump cuts to help smooth the flow.

Thank you!

Yes, I've been fighting against clipping - each time I take the bike out, I feel I'm lowering the gain down a bit more each time. I felt like I was close on this one, but now I see that I was modulating my speech volume more than I realized, and yeah - the clipping is pretty noticeable in spots.

As for the 2nd cam, I agree completely. As much as I don't necessarily want to complicate my workflow by doubling up my footage (or more than doubling, if we're talking 360), I really do think it will improve my flexibility significantly in the edit.

Appreciate the feedback!

 

[lonerockz]

It was a good early outing. I would have put the camera a lot closer to you for the off bike footage. Depending on the device you are really small.

What do you use for editing software. I've moved to Davinci and it has a lot of power to fix the sound levels. This tutorial was a real help in helping me fix mine:

I too don't like jump cuts for on bike footage as it ruins flow, BUT... with the addition of a second camera it transforms your ability to make cuts. Because you make the cut and switch cameras at the same time. Yes a careful watcher will notice that you are skipping down the road with each camera switch, but most people wont really notice. In my first video the first 50 seconds is cut down from 4 minutes in real time. The second 50 seconds was about 3 minutes real time. There are a couple of clumsy cuts (Hey I'm new!) but most of them are just fine. In my case they made these segments watchable. I pause for too long as I'm dealing with traffic or what not. So not only is it shorter, but is much better. I'm working on my next set of videos and I'm getting much better at this.

The other thing a second camera does is it makes mistakes on your primary camera less painful. On day two of my trip my helmet mount let go. I was able to film with just the GoPro Max I have on the bike and still get useable footage. Less important if you are 30 minutes from home, but a life saver on a trip.

In addition one video I watched mentioned that by being in the shot more often people feel a closer personal connection with you. I think it was on Wheelie Good TV or TheMissendenFlyer.

I do realize these are expensive toys though and not everyone can afford to run 2. If you do @Drakhen99 has some great tutorials on editing in Davinci.

 

[TallADVer]

It was a good early outing. I would have put the camera a lot closer to you for the off bike footage. Depending on the device you are really small.

....


I do realize these are expensive toys though and not everyone can afford to run 2. If you do @Drakhen99 has some great tutorials on editing in Davinci.

Thank you very much for the detailed notes!

Yep, that's edited on Resolve, but I clearly didn't spend enough time on the audio levels on that one, other than eyeballing the audio waveforms. I'll definitely review that tutorial.

Yeah, I definitely see the potential for adding a rear-facing or 360 camera. I'm in the process of talking myself into a 360 (probably one of the Insta360s), though I'm still in the early stages of researching them. I'll probably get a few more videos under my belt so I can keep working on the basics before adding in another dimension to the workflow. And then I'll need to consider a more photogenic helmet... You know, I'm really not good at picking cheap hobbies...

Thanks again!

 

[Hippo-Drones]

I suffer with expensive hobbies too... just getting into RC cars at the moment.... could have gotten a real car for what I paid for the last one!

 

[TallADVer]

Ha! Yeah, I went through an RC helicopter phase a few years back, with some fellow compulsive hobbyists at work. Not quite the same, but it does add up.

It really is true. We don't ever really grow up, but the toys get way more expensive...

 

[Drakhen99]

Very cool first outing! As far as 2nd cameras go, whichever way you go will be a big addition to the videos, and it hides edits, which might be my favorite part

I won't repeat what everyone else says, but yeah, the jump cuts aren't really noticed by anyone.

-John

 

[TallADVer]

Thanks John - I appreciate it! It's cool to know that some of the early stage head-scratching over stuff like jump cuts isn't unique to me

 

[Drakhen99]

Thanks John - I appreciate it! It's cool to know that some of the early stage head-scratching over stuff like jump cuts isn't unique to me

Anyone who's been around a while has had those same moments... there's at least 1,000 decisions you have to make in each video, 99% of which won't make a lick of difference, LOL.

-John

 

[lonerockz]

Thank you very much for the detailed notes!

[snip]

Yeah, I definitely see the potential for adding a rear-facing or 360 camera. I'm in the process of talking myself into a 360 (probably one of the Insta360s), though I'm still in the early stages of researching them. [snip]

Thanks again!

I have both, the i360 X3 is a slightly better camera. It has more shooting resolutions and modes, but honestly the footage it creates isn't much better than a Max. The workflow for editing in Davinci is the same - Recode using their app, use the reframe360 plugin in Davinci.

I use the Max on the bike for several reasons. First is the size of the camera. It is very unobtrusive in my footage. The tall skinny X3 i find super distracting in my helmet camera shot when I had it mounted. Second, is that I can backup my Max footage to the GoPro cloud service. As previously mentioned I take way too much footage and not having to keep a local copy once I am done with it is great. The Max is a bit cheaper.

You will be equally satisfied with either camera. Which is to say that you may hate both.

 

[R-Rated]

Thank you!

Yes, I've been fighting against clipping - each time I take the bike out, I feel I'm lowering the gain down a bit more each time.

What device are you using to record your audio track? I take it you are adjusting the gain on the device. Is there a way to look at the gain level in your editing program and if it shows the clipping?

There are some really great videos showing on PowerDirector how to edit the audio. I am sure other programs have similar abilites.

So as not to spam videos that are not mine, here is the title of each

How to Edit Audio to Make Better
Videos I PowerDirector

How to Quickly Normalize & Adjust
Your Audio I PowerDirector

 

[R-Rated]

I won't repeat what everyone else says, but yeah, the jump cuts aren't really noticed by anyone.

-John

There is a Joji Miller video as Filthy Frank where he is answering trolls comments. When he gets to the one about jump cuts

He.
Cut.
For.
Every.
Word.


I always try to keep the reaction MST3K/Rifftrax has to a bad jump cut. But yeah, small ones don't mean much.

 

[TallADVer]

I have both, the i360 X3 is a slightly better camera. It has more shooting resolutions and modes, but honestly the footage it creates isn't much better than a Max. The workflow for editing in Davinci is the same - Recode using their app, use the reframe360 plugin in Davinci.

I use the Max on the bike for several reasons. First is the size of the camera. It is very unobtrusive in my footage. The tall skinny X3 i find super distracting in my helmet camera shot when I had it mounted. Second, is that I can backup my Max footage to the GoPro cloud service. As previously mentioned I take way too much footage and not having to keep a local copy once I am done with it is great. The Max is a bit cheaper.

You will be equally satisfied with either camera. Which is to say that you may hate both.

Thanks for the comparison! Watching some side-by-side reviews, it certainly seems like the X3 has real advantages in image quality (detail and dynamic range), and some advantages in the tracking options through their app. And even though I have a GoPro, I've resisted buying into GoPro Cloud since I keep my media on a home server, so that's probably not going to weigh my decision. Judging just by the cameras, the X3 would likely be my top choice.

Except, I do get your point about its form factor being kind of obtrusive. In many motovlogs, I've also noticed it sticking out like... well, a sore thumb. And the GoPro is $50 cheaper, which isn't huge, but that's an extra battery right there.

Decisions, decisions...

 

[TallADVer]

What device are you using to record your audio track? I take it you are adjusting the gain on the device. Is there a way to look at the gain level in your editing program and if it shows the clipping?
...

I'm using an inexpensive Zoom H1n, and dropping the gain down to what I thought was a reasonably low level based on a prior test. But either I wasn't listening carefully enough to the test, or my levels on this video were just louder... maybe I was driving faster, or maybe I had extra caffeine before the ride or something. Anyway, the recorder does have an auto gain setting -- I was inclined not to trust that, but in retrospect, I probably should give it a try. Who knows, could save me some time in the edit.

When I was editing the video, I didn't notice the telltale hard clipping affect on the waveform display, but then I probably didn't check the loud sections. Add to that my only cursory familiarity with Resolve's audio tools, and a very quick attempt at applying compression, and I think all signs point to newbie error

Thanks for the video references - I definitely have some more learning (and test rides) to do! Oh yeah, and now I won't be able to see an obvious jump cut without thinking of MST3K, so thanks for that!

 

[Drakhen99]

There is a Joji Miller video as Filthy Frank where he is answering trolls comments. When he gets to the one about jump cuts

He.
Cut.
For.
Every.
Word.


I always try to keep the reaction MST3K/Rifftrax has to a bad jump cut. But yeah, small ones don't mean much.

I did that once... kind of. I had one camera going I think, and every time there was a break of at least 2/3 of a second, I cut it out. Took a while to do all the cuts, and it came out jumpy as all get-out, but it got the highest retention of any of my videos at the time. Also, there are some fairly successful people on YT who cut like that all the time.

I basically cut if there's more than a second or blank space. I can see it in the audio waveform, so I just cut cut cut. Nobody's complained - yet.

-John

 

[Drakhen99]

Thanks for the comparison! Watching some side-by-side reviews, it certainly seems like the X3 has real advantages in image quality (detail and dynamic range), and some advantages in the tracking options through their app. And even though I have a GoPro, I've resisted buying into GoPro Cloud since I keep my media on a home server, so that's probably not going to weigh my decision. Judging just by the cameras, the X3 would likely be my top choice.

Except, I do get your point about its form factor being kind of obtrusive. In many motovlogs, I've also noticed it sticking out like... well, a sore thumb. And the GoPro is $50 cheaper, which isn't huge, but that's an extra battery right there.

Decisions, decisions...

Just to be a contrarian... I'm not sure if I mentioned it, but I recently did a ride video to High Rock, Maryland... and incorporated my GoPro Max when I got there. Due to GoPro's Player app not exporting my preferred format, I used CineForm at 5.6k with the highest bitrate [you can see my 5 Fast Tips video I put out a few days ago for details], and the resulting video file was huge [42gb] but PACKED with detail. It looked better than any Insta360 footage or Max footage I'd ever seen.

-John

 

[TallADVer]

I did that once... kind of. I had one camera going I think, and every time there was a break of at least 2/3 of a second, I cut it out. Took a while to do all the cuts, and it came out jumpy as all get-out, but it got the highest retention of any of my videos at the time. Also, there are some fairly successful people on YT who cut like that all the time.

I basically cut if there's more than a second or blank space. I can see it in the audio waveform, so I just cut cut cut. Nobody's complained - yet.

-John

I'm beginning to see that it's a matter of personal style. I can accept obvious jump cuts if they're done smoothly and consistently. It's all about flow of the narrative, and where you want to direct the viewer's focus. Is the focus on the dialogue (monologue)? Then you cut to make the monologue flow as well as it can. I think that's why your (John's) method of primarily focusing on your face, and cutting to eliminate "dead air" works well for you. Or you can have a focus on the route, with the dialogue enhancing the ride - in that case, you need to be more selective with cuts. Lonerocz's current project is about telling a story in a more documentary style, and probably needs to be handled on a per-"scene" basis. Then you have the ride review style (I'm thinking someone like Big Rock Moto or Cager on 2 Wheels), which is more about sharing the experience - in that case, there have to be large enough "chunks" between cuts for the viewer to feel that they're along for the ride. I'm sure there are other scenarios, that's just off the top of my head.

As for me, I'm still in the experimentation phase, so it's probably in my best interest to try all of the above.

Oh, and feel free to tell me I'm overanalyzing all this... I'm used to it

 

[Drakhen99]

I'm beginning to see that it's a matter of personal style. I can accept obvious jump cuts if they're done smoothly and consistently. It's all about flow of the narrative, and where you want to direct the viewer's focus. Is the focus on the dialogue (monologue)? Then you cut to make the monologue flow as well as it can. I think that's why your (John's) method of primarily focusing on your face, and cutting to eliminate "dead air" works well for you. Or you can have a focus on the route, with the dialogue enhancing the ride - in that case, you need to be more selective with cuts. Lonerocz's current project is about telling a story in a more documentary style, and probably needs to be handled on a per-"scene" basis. Then you have the ride review style (I'm thinking someone like Big Rock Moto or Cager on 2 Wheels), which is more about sharing the experience - in that case, there have to be large enough "chunks" between cuts for the viewer to feel that they're along for the ride. I'm sure there are other scenarios, that's just off the top of my head.

As for me, I'm still in the experimentation phase, so it's probably in my best interest to try all of the above.

Oh, and feel free to tell me I'm overanalyzing all this... I'm used to it

I don't think you're over-analyzing it. I think you nailed it.

I just prefer a faster pace, and I don't always speak at a faster pace. When I want to show the route or the journey, I use a music montage of shorter clips.

If I were riding through a scenic spot that I wanted to show, I'd leave the blank space.

-John